Who is at the table when decisions are made? Babah Tarawally and Jan Braat on inclusion in Utrecht

Outside you see diversity, inside city hall less and less the higher you look. The third episode of De Tafel van Utrecht was about work, networks and unequal investment.

What happens when you look outside in Utrecht and see diversity, but inside the municipal office, above a certain pay grade, you only see white faces? That question was the starting point of the third episode of De Tafel van Utrecht Podcast, on Saturday 23 May.

At the table were Jan Braat, policy adviser on migration at the municipality of Utrecht for more than 25 years, and Babah Tarawally, journalist, writer and longtime columnist for Trouw. The presenter was Leroy Lucas, who had just started on the city council and was given the diversity and inclusion portfolio.

Inclusion comes first

The conversation was about application procedures that overlook informal experience and about the difference between hard skills and soft skills. Bringing people in is one thing, keeping them is another. The question also came up of why applicants without experience at the municipality often drop out, and whether people who already work there should get more training opportunities.

Tarawally explained why, in his view, inclusion comes before diversity. And why we are not mangoes, as he put it himself.

The talk also covered starting a business without a network in a world of old boys networks, Plan Einstein and what came out of it, and unequal investment: what it is, what it isn't and when it can be called a success. Tarawally also talked about his two new books.

De Tafel van Utrecht is the hybrid podcast of Omroep AfroNet, recorded monthly in front of an audience at TivoliVredenburg and streamed live on YouTube and Spotify. The full episode can be watched again on YouTube.

Bronnen

• Omroep AfroNet op YouTube: de volledige live-uitzending